Welcoem study this case with me, stroke and veins problem

My friend, 65 years old, female. About 8 years ago, she started to have serious problem in these veins of her legs, doctors put her to sleep and cleaned these veins 2 or 3 times. About 3 years ago, she got a stroke, couldn't talk very well, right hand side of body move not so good, toes in right food wouldn't move. Today, has superficial pulse in Heart part, but not rapid, tongue proper and coating are fine, but with bleeding in the foot when she feel itchy and scratch it. A little bit swollen in her right food. My questions are,
1, Is the veins problem relative with the stroke?
2. What is the treatment for her?

Dear Zhen,
It sounds quite a difficult case!!!

It's a bit difficult to tell how to treat the case, for it is really necessary to see patient and then to decide how to treat.

As to my personal opinion, the leg could be understood as local problem, which is most probably the varicosity and is not so easy of treatment.
I also think it's a bit too late to treat the varicostiy with acupuncture for that patient.

To treat the stroke, I think acupuncture is of some help, in fact the hemiplegia is one of the common indication of acupuncture.

I'm not quite sure if there are relations between the varicosity and the stroke. But I'm not quite sure whether the stroke was related more or less with the surgical operation of the varicosity.

Ok, that's my personal understanding of your case, but I couldn't determine anything for I never see the patient so it's impossible to give the treatment.

Dear David,

Thanks for answer.

About varicosity, one of my other friend, 35 years. She start to have vien problem, if it is not too late, what can I do for her?

About this old lady, I guess " Yin defficiency causing Yang floating, excess yang turned to wind then caused stroke 8 years ago, now she still has the same etiology", and she has the 水肿的阴水。 My treatment will be, reinforce kidney Yin for the superfacial pules,and reinforce spleen yang for the 阴水. Like, SanYingJiao, TaiXi, Fuliu, Taibai, Zusanli, shuifen, qihai,xuehai, using reinforce way. Every other day take 1 treatment, 10 times for a group.

Could you please tell if there is something wrong.

Thanks a lot

Hey, Zhen,
What's wrong with your friends? Why do they often suffer from varicosity?

I think the 35-year-old lady could be treated with sucn points as Sanyinjiao, Taichong (or Xingjian), Zusanli, Xuehai, Taiyuan, Jingqu, Yanglingquan, Hegu, etc for the needling.
If there are no heat signs, you may also do moxibustion for the local region.
Maybe certain Qigong exercise could also help.
For the combination of herbal medicines is no harm.

While for the first old lady, I don't know how to say.
You said it's a case of "Yin defficiency causing Yang floating, excess yang turned to wind then caused stroke", but I don't know any symptoms and signs to support your differential diganosis of syndrome. From what you have posted the last time, I couldn't confirm your diagnosis.
And it IS difficult to make a diagnosis only by the word, not by observing the patient personal.

Very often, the edema (水肿) is due to the deficiency of kidney and spleen Qi or Yang, even it's Yin water (阴水).

Personally I suggest to treat this case by means of promoting the circulation of Qi and blood, and on the basis, the kidney and spleen should be reinforced, but not only the kidney Yin, the kidney Qi should be reinforced as well. That's only the theory, so the Chinese proverb says: "Talking the strategy only on the papers."
In any sense, some local points are quite necessary. In addition to your prescription, I would supplement Yinlingquan, Fenglong, Quchi, Huantiao, Hegu, and Taichong. Please tell me why.

You don't have to do Shuifen. Maybe it's good point for water, but usually it's a good one for the local water, such as ascites. For sure, if you do it, it won't be harmful.

You don't have to do the points altogether every time, but you may alternate them.

It's called a "course of treatment", not a group.

Ok, that's my opinion, only on the ground of what you have mentioned.
Not quite sure what to say, in fact, as I've repeated many times, it's only the "talking the strategy only on the papers"

This also reminds us of how important to do all the four diagnostic methods together.
Many practitioners of traditional Chinese medicine would ignore the method of observing a patient. That's totally wrong!!!
Without seeing a patient, it's indeed VERY difficult to give an idea.





[quote:fd7983b952]About varicosity, one of my other friend, 35 years. She start to have vien problem, if it is not too late, what can I do for her?

About this old lady, I guess " Yin defficiency causing Yang floating, excess yang turned to wind then caused stroke 8 years ago, now she still has the same etiology", and she has the 水肿的阴水。 My treatment will be, reinforce kidney Yin for the superfacial pules,and reinforce spleen yang for the 阴水. Like, SanYingJiao, TaiXi, Fuliu, Taibai, Zusanli, shuifen, qihai,xuehai, using reinforce way. Every other day take 1 treatment, 10 times for a group.
[/quote:fd7983b952]

I think we are talking about treating the old lady, for her hemiplegia and the edema of her legs. Is that right?
So, Yinlingquan is the best one for the dampness, it is more helpful to reduce the pathogens than reinforce the anti-pathogenic force; Fenglong is a special point for phlegm, and very often, the stroke could be related with phlegm; Taichong and Hegu together are called the “Four Gate” points, so don’t you think we should open the doors to let the qi move well?
Huantiao is one of the best point for the leg pain or the difficult movement of legs, such as hemiplegia.
Quchi is often used for the hemiplegia affecting arms.
When you study the treatment of diseases in course D, I think you may find all the information.

Thanks.
But this is first time I heart about "Four gate" points, what are the other 2 points?

Take care

Just Taichong and Hegu, altogether 4!

Thanks.

Alright! It's my pleasure:D